S3, Ep. 123- Going The Extra Mile With Lacey Sites

Leah: Hey everyone. Welcome back to the show. Leah here. I probably am on maternity leave as you listen to this, but I’m excited to be joined by a close friend of mine, my own coach, and a fellow entrepreneurial mama. Lacey Sites. Hi Lacey.

Lacey Sites: Hi. I’m so happy to be here.

Leah: Thanks so much for being here. We wanted to come record this episode for you guys to talk a little bit about motherhood, a little bit about business. But the main topic I invited Lacey on to talk about today is where entrepreneurs are stopping themselves, especially these days. I think Lacey and I, we’ve been through a lot together. I was thinking about this before.

Yeah. Our, our episode Lacey, like you’ve been my coach for years, but we’ve been through, we kind of became moms that are around the same time. Yeah. And then we tragically both lost our dads in not too long of a window. Um, and then on a much less serious note, we’ve seen a lot of businesses go through a lot of the same things and we’ve had a lot of conversations about them. So I wanted to bring it here.

Lacey Sites: Yes. Oh, I’m so excited for this.

Leah: Yeah, so I think where this kind of idea came from for me is seeing this year in 2024, a lot of business owners feel very frustrated with what it takes to run a business. Mm-Hmm. . And I think the main reason for that is because we’re seeing the pendulum swing in the other direction from a covid bubble and the pandemic bubble of things being significantly easier. And I think one of the things Lacey’s done a very good job of her whole business and what I’ve learned so much about is just treating your business like a business, getting neutral about what it takes to get it done and not feeling so emotionally attached to it. 

And yet I think we’re in this, this kind of industry-wide phenomenon where people have to do more than ever and it’s feeling very emotional. So I wanna let you start a little bit because that’s kind of where I’m at. What do you think about all of that?

Lacey Sites: It’s so interesting. So something that I wanna say here, ’cause I feel like this is a little bit relevant, but um, I have my MBA and I always joke about how like everyone thinks, like having an MBA is such a big deal unless you have an MBA and then you’re kind of like, I mean it was good, but it’s like, it’s not all that applicable right now. 

And, but what is applicable that I think I am like so served by, and why I think I really see this for what it is, is because all you do in business school is study like how other businesses are. I mean, I’m kind of kidding, but not really. Right? Like you’re like case studying, like what, what went wrong here? What could have been different? Or, I mean, maybe even where they like to shine, right?

Like how did they really capitalize on this market? That kind of stuff. And so for me, having had that background, my mindset is just always like, it’s always gonna be up and down. Markets always shift. We’re always gonna have to adjust. Like there’s gonna be booms and there’s gonna be busts. Like this is how it is. And so to me when everyone thinks like, oh, it should be how it was in 2021 or whatever, I’m like, that’s just not how it works. 

Like I just see it from this like very logical perspective of like, that’s not how it works for small businesses. It’s not how it works for big businesses. It’s not how it works in our economy. And I think like we do such a disservice to people in our space when we act like when people do the thing of like, oh, if your business is good, it should always be good. And it should never, ever have a downturn. It should never take a step backwards. It’s like that’s not real business.

Leah: Right. Right. And it’s also not to mention, I think like the disservice it does to you as a person, because it doesn’t really leave space for you to go through iterations of your own life and yes. To like have a business that can respect different seasons of your life. And that I think people forget that that’s kind of the whole point. 

Like they feel like they need to always be on this consistent or upward trajectory no matter what they’re going through personally, but then at the same time want to have a business that can like support them through what they’re going through personally. And I think part of that is knowing that some of the time things aren’t going to be as quote, shiny because maybe you don’t need them to be, that’s like not what you’re meant to be doing at the time. I obviously am saying this nine months pregnant . No.

Lacey Sites: And I’m grateful a hundred percent, you know, that it is meant to flow with you. What do you think, oh, go ahead.

Lacey Sites: No, I was just gonna say, I think that that’s something that I notice in our space that really puts me off is that I feel like in the corporate setting it’s almost like, well if you’re gonna have a kid or whatever, like you’re screwed. Like that’s the, almost like the mentality, right? Like that kind of thing. But in our lives, you should expect something like a step back or you should expect something to impact your career. 

But in our space we do the have a kid and don’t have any impact from it whatsoever. Have a kid and like double your income that same year. Right? And it’s like these insane like sides of the pendulum where it’s like, what if it’s somewhere in the middle where like, yes, you don’t have to pay this massive price, but you also don’t have to like prove yourself that like you can be a mom and like never have anything shift in your business ’cause of it either, you know?

Leah: Right. And like what does that do to other moms that are trying to like to heal and think, you know, step into a new season and they’re comparing themselves to someone who’s basically saying, if you have any negative impact from this like huge life altering change, then you’re doing something wrong. How is that helpful to anyone?

Lacey Sites: Amen.

Leah: Um, so I think you and I have talked a lot about, and I think like everyone has had this conversation in their own way, the difference between what a successful business looks like on Instagram versus what a successful business really looks like. Yeah. And personally, I think I’ve probably ranted to you about this. I’ve gone back and forth with my, with my own business and feeling sometimes like, you know, I always wanna be transparent about everything it took for me to have seven figure sales years and become a stay-at-home mom and everything. 

And at the same time, thanks to a lot of the mindset work I’ve done and just perspectives I’ve chosen some of the hardships that people have really gone through. It’s not that I didn’t go through them, they just didn’t feel as baked to me because I just sort of felt like this is kind of par for the course. Yep. 

What do you think is happening? Do you think people are more kind of fooled for lack? Like, and I don’t mean it so maliciously, but do you think that there’s just a lack of transparency or do you think that there’s a lack of just understanding about what it really is and how can we bridge that gap for people?

Lacey Sites: Oh, I mean I think there’s a hundred percent lack of transparency.

At Least. I mean, not not for everyone obviously. Yeah. Like right. But I think that like if you build your brand, let’s just use this as an example. If you build your brand on the message of like, you know, your business should only grow and it should never go down and you should have these like income set points and dah, dah, dah. Like of course you’re not gonna transparently share when that’s not happening. 

And I’m not saying that everyone even has to necessarily, right? Again, like you said, you and I talked about this ad nauseum, like where where are, is it right to share and where do you get to keep something for yourself? But I just say that to say like, I think that a lot of people don’t shift their message with shifting times or seasons because they doubled down, they doubled down on it so hard that when things shift, like they’re kind of in a bad position.

So I, I mean, I will tell you like, you know, I have many clients that have been in business for years and are making seven figures, obviously you being one of them. I have been in rooms and masterminds with people making seven, eight figures beyond that. I have not had a single experience in the last year where there hasn’t been a conversation of like, this year’s been different . So it, it just is a thing. 

And again, like it’s just normal. Like we had a huge boom, like 2020 to 2022 ish, right? I think 2023 into 2024 was a lot harder for people. This is normal, this is okay. And honestly, business owners at that level and most of my experience like that are doing a really good job in treating their business like a business aren’t scared to say that. They’re not scared to say like, yeah, this is what happens. Sometimes the people that are scared to say it are the ones who had a message counter to that.

Leah: Right.

Lacey Sites: Right.

Leah: They, yeah.

Lacey Sites: It’s hard to go back against that, you know?

Leah: What do you think, like if you think of someone who maybe has recently hit six figures and they’re seeing someone who’s between like half a million and a million, where do you think is there, do you see a most common edge or maybe three or so things that’s like they are, that’s just where it gets really hard to figure out team or that’s where people really put their head in the sand around just like numbers because they may, you can get to six figures off of a lot of emotion and flow and like a lot of not systematized business. Or is it they’re not willing to invest in marketing, they’re not willing to be wrong. Like what is that edge or what are some of the edges?

Lacey Sites: I personally think it’s high. Like, to get very specific, I’ll say like 170 5K to like 220 KI think is the hardest stage of business . I really do. Because I think it’s so much of what you’ve just said, like you’ve built enough off of probably like sheer excitement and momentum, and all of that kind of stuff. Like grit. Grit, yeah. Yeah. And then you kind of hit this point where like, you’re making enough money that you’re scared to not have it. 

Now you’re making enough money that you have money to make investments and you’re probably feeling a lot of pressure to scale really quickly. So what happens to a lot of people at that point is that they start over investing in like a ton of random crap , right. That doesn’t necessarily solve a specific problem for them because they think, well if I just put more and more and more money into it, then like, that should take me further faster.

They also are trying to skip the foundations typically with that. So they’re not going like, let me get my system set up. Let me get my team really locked in. Let me, they’re like, whatever, let me buy this like random funnel audit or something like, and I do funnel audits by the way, so I’m not trying to say that’s wrong, but you get what I mean. 

Like, don’t do that if you don’t have a system and a supportive team. So that’s like helping you to achieve whatever the funnel audit is gonna tell you. Um, and I feel like that’s where it gets really tough is like they try to ignore the foundations and try to over invest too, to get to like skip them almost.

Leah: Most of us, as you’re saying, oh, go ahead. I was just, as you were saying this, I was like, oh my God, I can think of literally three things that I spent money on in that phase that I didn’t need to. And I I love that you got specific with that income range. Um, I, I would totally agree. I often say that like, in some ways six figures harder than zero. 

You know, zero is hard because you have no proof of concept. Like you really have to do the mindset work around like I am straight up delusional and I have to own it and I have to block up everyone in my life that doesn’t believe in that. 

But, but it’s, it’s so fun and you don’t have anything to lose. And it can feel like every day is kind of like, I remember feeling like every day was Christmas during that first six figures because it was like you, every day you kind of got up and got to see what you could create and then you get to six figures and to your point you’re sort of like, wow, I am paralyzed with where to go from here.

Leah: Like, do I, should I become a LinkedIn expert? Should I, you know, get a blog dialed in, like yeah, do I have to learn Pinterest? And it, it just can feel like, okay, I, I know that I probably need to only focus on one or two things, but I have no idea which one or two things to do. You’re kind of floating in space. And I think for a lot of people, me included, you might have made more money at that point than you ever made from a nine to five job. 

But I didn’t have any money ’cause I had, I went into debt and I was investing heavily back into my business. And so it felt very, very, very hard to navigate. Um, and I can tell people to give context during that time. Some of the investments that I made that I don’t think were helpful were, I’ve done, I’ve, my two biggest, I would say like flop investments.

And this is no knock on the people who, um, ran the businesses that I invested in, but it was just not what I needed at the time. Were, um, ad agencies, they are so expensive and I personally learned to run ads on my own and I ended up, I’ve, I’ve probably spent upward of 30 or 40 grand on ad agencies unnecessarily. ’cause I felt like it’s what I should do without actually understanding what the ROI behind that was. 

Um, and then the other one that came to mind as you were saying that was, ugh, I, it’s kind of slipping me now. There was definitely another one, but, uh, I think a lot of it is like you’re just kind of throwing money at people and things and shiny things and not really having a full understanding of why you think that that is the move for you. Right. Then.

Lacey Sites: Totally. Like I was saying, we do, we’ve done some done for you funnel audits at like Dateable and it’s so funny because sometimes people will reach out around that and I’m like, okay, like where are you at? Like, what do you da da da? And it’s like they’re at that level and they don’t even have a fully functioning funnel yet, right.

And I’m like, you don’t need this. Like, what, I won’t even be able to really help you, but they’re just looking for whatever feels like it’s okay, this is gonna take me to the next level. And usually at that level, what you have to do is set the level set for a minute, get your systems in place, get your foundations in place, create like a really strong springboard to jump to the next level on. 

And I think people hate doing that. Like we hate feeling like we’re slowing down the momentum, even though it’s like, obviously not what we’re doing, we’re speeding it up massively. But I feel like at that stage, like you really do need someone in your corner that’s gonna say that to you and that’s gonna be like, no, like let’s get you set up for all that’s to come instead of trying to race to that because it’s gonna fall apart. It’s like you’re, you’re it’s like a house of cards, yeah.

Leah: Exactly. Exactly. I, um, something that I’ve been thinking about a lot lately as you know, Lacey, because you’ve helped me do it. I have recently created a course on my passive park system. And even though I have been in the coaching industry for eight years, when my son, you know, became a toddler, I decided to build this system out. And um, I started building it out last May and, and I started making money from it pretty quickly. 

But it wasn’t until I would say December when it really was in this overflow everyday multiple sales place. And the system works, the system is effective. I’m very proud of it. But as I’ve built out this course and I talked so much about testing in it and how long it takes to, you know, get there, uh, it’s been very eye-opening to see how many very, very, um, successful business owners, not that they aren’t willing to test on the surface, I think they understand that’s what it takes.

Leah: But there’s almost something very hard about feeling like you’re a beginner again. And yet if you’re building out like anything new, no matter how many times you’ve done something in that way, you kind of have to go back to that. How do you help your clients do that? Especially if it feels like they might be temporarily losing money or if they, um, you know, maybe start second guessing if it’s what they really wanna do because they thought it would be kind of a quicker result than it is. 

Like how do you navigate if something is really worth going back to that beginning stage with them and then how do and what do you see your most successful clients do to like sit in that and make it happen?

Lacey Sites: I love this question. So I think there’s like a lot of important pieces to what you just said. The first thing is that I think you knew it was gonna take that long so it was easier for you to adjust to that. Like, I have a client who came to me and like, she had a funnel that was kind of working, but she wanted to really take it evergreen, really ramp up the income, like had a huge income goal. And I said to her, it’s gonna take a year.

 Yeah. Like, I think it’s gonna take us at least a year to get there. Are you willing to hang for a year? But like that honesty made it easier. And she did. We took that from about 10 K to over 40K a month, the path of recurrent, I mean, it’s not passive, but you get what I mean, right? Just like it’s automated. Half the park sale is passive, but not, um, yeah.

Leah: I always like automated better than passive. Yeah. Because it’s like, yes, it’s hands off, but it’s not. 

Lacey Sites: I agree. But like it took a year and so yeah. You can look at that in hindsight and be like, oh, I would totally take a year to four times my income each month off of that da da. But when you’re in it, it’s so hard to see that. And one of the number one reasons is because most people think it shouldn’t take whatever however long it took you seven months, a year, whatever. And it took you seven months as someone who is like an expert in this too. 

Right. You know what I mean? Right. Um, so I just think that that’s part of it. Like I think that we need more honesty in our space of like what it really takes to do some of this stuff and what that trajectory looks like. I think when we know that it’s a little bit easier to settle into that. I think when someone’s saying to us, oh yeah, we’ll get your funnel set up in two weeks and you’re good to go.

Leah: Yeah. Like you can have your funnel set up, but that doesn’t mean it’s profitable in two weeks.

Lacey Sites: Exactly. Exactly.

Leah: That’s the biggest thing. And, and I think you’re so right because I knew how to do a lot of what I did before I did it. And I had wanted to, and I liked the idea of it and I thought it was so smart, but it wasn’t until I had this big reason of like, okay, my son’s gonna start school. I really wanna spend more time with him than I would like, I don’t care how long it takes because this is the only thing that makes sense for the future of my business. 

And I think that that’s the certainty business owners need to get at more is like, I have such a strong why around why I’m doing this that I don’t really care how long it takes and I’m willing to do whatever testing and help and hire people to help me if I need.

Leah: You know, I’ve, I’ve hired people to look at my sales pages and I’ve had you help me with your, with your expertise and data and everything, um, to get there. And when I’m honest with myself, even though I knew how to do it for years, I didn’t have that strong of a reason why it wasn’t worth it to me. I was able to make more money doing other things and I wasn’t a mom.

So I was happy to do it. 

And I think that’s what people have to be honest with themselves about, which I think is hard to do because there’s a difference between you feeling burnt out and frustrated and having a long week or a long month and feeling like this urge of escapism versus feeling like, okay, this is an escapism, this is my future, I’m willing to do whatever.

Lacey Sites: Yes. I think that you just hit the nail on the head, which is like that you have to really know your goal and be so bought in on it. Because I think that that’s what makes people again, at that level especially jump around a lot is because they change their goal. 

Like sometimes their goal is to step back and have more automation in their business and have something that’s working for them and giving them more freedom. Sometimes their goal is like triple their income next month and doing both of those at the same time is really hard and nobody’s being honest about that. Totally. Totally. 

Leah: Impossible I would say.

Lacey Sites: Yeah. I mean, unless you just don’t sleep, I guess or something like that. Right. But like yeah, it is like to, you have to pick, right? It’s like do you really wanna work on stepping back and creating systems and scalability and all of that or are you trying to like to sprint it out next month and triple your income? They’re just entirely different things. Right. And most people change their mind on that four times in the same month.

Leah: Totally. Totally.

Lacey Sites: And then they’re like, why is neither working? And they’re super, super frustrated and so then they try to spend more and more money to solve that problem and it’s just maddening. And the truth is like we just have to, again, like it from a business perspective, like of course you can’t do both of those at the same time. Like it’s so obvious, but it’s like we get so in these loops again and I think our industry pushes a narrative about it and it just makes everyone nuts. 

Leah: It’s true. It’s true. And it’s, it’s something that is conflicting as, as someone who does believe that there are so many infinite possibilities that come with owning your own business and you wanna keep that whimsical spirit alive, ’cause it’s real. But it is just, it is such a fine line between having a big vision and optimism and excitement about bending kind of your own possibility versus like completely self-sabotaging because you’re expecting yourself to do something that just doesn’t make sense at all.

Lacey Sites: Let me tell you what I think about it. If it’s helpful, um, for people listening, ’cause I, I think about this a lot. I really do believe in the infinite possibilities of our business. Where I think it gets up is when we include timeline

In that, right? So it’s like I believe in the infinite possibility of having the hottest body on the planet, but I am logical enough to know that that’s not gonna happen in the next three weeks, even though I believe in that possibility. And I think that’s what’s true in business. Like you can believe in the possibility to create anything you want, but trying to force it into this timeline of, and it needs to be in the next three weeks and I need to triple my income and have this whole funnel running and, and, and in this set amount of time. Like to me that’s, that is not how it works. And that’s where we get ourselves really stuck.

Leah: But what do you think about, I mean I I I agree with you, but I think that the nuance to that comes with, ’cause a lot of times if you kind of present that as having the mindset of what you want is a when not an if. Yeah.  But when you are sacrificing things to make that happen, and just to give a different example of this, I just had a conversation with a girlfriend around the, about this a few weeks ago who is trying to conceive, she’s not, I’m not gonna disclose her name. So I don’t think that, and I don’t think she’d care if I did.

But my point is, um, she’s been trying for some months and I had kind of this mindset of like, I know what’s gonna happen for you guys. I’m gonna keep speaking like that unless you tell me that that’s not helpful.

Leah: But in my mind it feels like you’re just meant to be a parent and it’s not an if but a when for you and your family. And she’s like, I agree with you and I am editing a lot of my lifestyle right now to make this happen that I can’t sustain for three years. You know, dietary preferences, like things that she caught out, things that, um, she’s just doing for her hormonal health. I’m not gonna go into it. Totally fair. Yeah. 

But I do think that that’s a good point, like if you’re working toward a goal and you might have the utmost earnest mindset of like, this will happen when, but until it happens, I’m gonna be spending this much on ads and I’m gonna be working these many hours or whatever. At what point do you have to say, okay, I need to find a more sustainable way to achieve this goal because I actually can’t do this for two or three years or something like that. 

Lacey Sites: I mean, I think obviously like to take the conception part out of it. ’cause I don’t know about the process there to, to speak to that in, in any like useful way, but like from a business perspective, right? Like I, I do think that that’s what you have to do.

Like I’m not saying that you don’t have sprint seasons or whatever, but if I like to look at myself and my own business, the reason I made a million dollars a year is because I liked what I was doing enough to work at it for six years to get there.

Leah: Yeah. Yeah.

Lacey Sites: Right. And so if I was like, I’m only willing to do it if I do it in the next year and I’m gonna make myself crazy and burn myself out for this year to try to get there and then if not, I’m gonna dip. Like that wouldn’t have served me at all. Like what actually happened is I made really good money for all six of those years even though it wasn’t a million. Right.

I love every bit of it and I really enjoyed the process. And so again, I think that one of those fallacies is that if I do something I hate for long enough, then I’ll buy myself the opportunity to do something I love. And I’ve  never see a work like that in business like

Leah: Yeah.

Lacey Sites: Really don’t.

Leah: I think it’s, yeah, I think it’s a really good point. I think you have to tell yourself, if I’m not willing to keep this up once I hit it, why should I be willing to do it while I’m on my way there? Um, I think I’m a little more of an adrenaline junkie than you are Lacey, though I do have my moment . I definitely thrive off of sprinting some of the time, but I feel like I have very clear boundaries with myself. This is how long I can do this for, this is how long I’m willing to do this for. 

And then after that, whatever, whatever happens, happens. Because you can get to a point where you’re like this, even if I, I have, there’s definitely parts of my business that I know I could be making more money doing, but I, it’s, I’m just not willing to do it. So we’re not doing it. 

Lacey Sites: Lemme give you some grace there though because when you sprint, you do it for a really particular thing that you actually can hit in that period of time. Yeah. When people do the like, I’m gonna be miserable and sprint it out for a year until I hit a million or something like that. That macro version of it I think makes you crazy. The micro version of like, I’m gonna sprint for three weeks for this launch or something is a totally different thing. I think we all have to be willing to do that sometimes.

Leah: Yeah, I think so too. And I think also to give myself a little credit, I am more of, I’m just more of an extreme person than you. So yeah, I will have longer sprints and more intense sprints than you, but then I also will take more time off I think, than you in general or like I’ll just take two weeks where I barely work and things like that. 

So you do have to find your rhythm. But I do think it’s a very important point that you gotta detract from the timeline and also have to manage what you’re doing in the meantime to get there.

Lacey Sites: Exactly. And you again, I think also from a personality perspective, enjoy the sprint. So it’s not like you’re like, I hate, I do hate

Leah: This much I can’t sustain, it’s not miserable.

Lacey Sites: Sustain it. Right? No, absolutely. It’s like I think about Gary V as an example here of like, people are like, oh my God, he seems like he works so much and he hustles so hard and oh, I’m like so anti -hustle and I’m like, you think he’s miserable? He’s loving life. He lives for that. He lives for that. So you just have to figure out what your version of that is. Maybe you live for this sprint sometimes and that’s totally okay. There’s nothing right or wrong about either one. It’s just like it has to be something you like enough to keep doing it. You love that. Those moments, you know, I do. 

Leah: I’ll never forget the first, like when I very, very first started my business, I was in Cambodia by myself, like trying to figure something out and I like had gotten up early and I was working on something and I looked at the clock and it was like 3:00 PM or whatever and I like had not realized that I hadn’t eaten or whatever. And at first I was like, oh my gosh, I’m not taking good care of myself. Like I’m alone in a southeast Asian country. I should probably go eat.

 And then I remember later talking to my dad about it and my dad was also an entrepreneur and he was like, man, I love that entrepreneurial spirit where sometimes you’re just so lost in your work that you and what you’re creating that you like lose track of time. 

And I was like, you know what? I love that he framed it that way, that it’s not this like, oh my gosh, you can’t even take care of yourself. Are you like a grown child? But it was more like embracing it sometimes. Like if that’s what your spirit’s leading you to do, then that’s okay. Obviously don’t make it a daily habit, but like there’s, and and so that gave me a lot of permission to lean into those sprints.

Lacey Sites: I think that’s what it is. Like our businesses need to be businesses. They take more from us than I think our industry is ever willing to admit. But they can also give us a lot if we let it, but we’re so conditioned to make everything wrong. I feel like in this industry, if you’re not making millions while working two hours a week , you’re doing like that, you’re wrong. 

You’re right. You’re screwing it up. Right.

 And that to me is the biggest issue by far because everyone thinks that’s like the holy grail or they’re somehow supposed to hack that and without realizing that, like actually maybe you would love your life if you let yourself sprint sometimes. Or like actually maybe you’d love your life if you didn’t try to push to this goal as fast as humanly possible at the expense of everything else or whatever. You know what I mean?

Leah: Totally. I totally agree. Well, I really appreciate you coming and chatting with me about this. You and I could talk about this for days, but I appreciate you being so transparent about what you see and what you’ve done and how you think you can still achieve a lot of the success people see. But do it in a way that makes sense and that doesn’t cost you your sanity.

Lacey Sites: Amen. I love it. Thank you so much for having me. I love this.

Leah: Yeah, me too. Thanks everyone for tuning in so much. I hope you guys have a good day and we’ll talk to you soon. Follow Lacey at a lit up life. Go to her website. She’s amazing. She’ll change your life and I’ll talk to you guys soon. . Bye lace. Thank you. 

Lacey Sites: Bye. Thank you.

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